Originally posted by Ptolemy2002
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Top 5 Most Overrated Towers
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Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
Is this before or after r30 because before player-sent MOABs have 1/2 HP and after that they get their full HP?I needed a new signature and profile picture because the bloonchipper is not in the game anymore. The new tower:
It’s a corrosive glue gunning layer stripping road spiking buff giving MOAB exploding transforming bloon shrinking tower dependent fairly cheap banana farm. It's... The Alchemist!
RIP Bloonchipper. You were a good tower
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Alright...once again, it seems I have gotten completely wrecked by naturespirit. I'e ignored this post for long enough; it's time to see if I can fix some of the damage.
As before, keep in mind that this is not supposed to be a list of the 5 most popular towers in the game that opens the eyes of every player from beginner to expert and revolutionizes the strategies used in the game. More specifically, it's an attempt to help new players just a little more in their travels to the top. With that in mind, these are likely the towers that most of these new players use and how the towers are used. I'm here to point those issues out.
Originally posted by naturespirit View Post5. No ones uses this so it has no place on the list.
4. For a while engineer was one of the best towers for defend mode and it's still good on pools if you use it correctly. I wouldn't say it's overrated, you're just pointing out all its weaknesses and how bad players use it poorly.
3. The reactor is not overrated, on most maps with the reactor and a few chippers you can defend an all out rainbow rush, if someone even does that, rainbows are expensive. If you get all out r13 every time then either you must have been playing horribly or you've been playing noobs.
But yeah, you and Mr. Scrub have convinced me that the stuff about sub was a pile of banana sandwiches (BS for short).
2. Ninja is not overrated by anyone with common sense. It's a late game tower not early game, you're just pointing out how bad players use it incorrectly. If a bunch of noobs use like 4 0/0 chippers on an all out grouped yellow rush does that make the tower bad or overrated? No it makes the player bad. Please stop assuming most people think the ninja is better than it is.
1. All wizards make regrow rushes worse, not just tornado ones. Also you're acting like wizard is useless.
It's pretty helpful on short maps since they are cheap and will actually pop stuff since there's not enough time for it to get worse due to your towers following up on the pops quickly.
Just like my other post, you seem to feel at least a little strongly about my list here. I'll try asking you, then: What is your list for top 5 most overrated towers? You seem to know a lot about the game; you should be able to give me another good list.Last edited by The Mochinator; 23-11-16, 06:10 PM.My shameless advertising:
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5. I said this with classic in mind and an actual match, not where you try to go for world records or play clubs. Also if you think ISAB and Tyler are good at the game, no wonder you think I'm good at the game.
4. Again, like I said with ninja, that's just people being stupid.
3. Good
2. It's not really people "overrating" ninja, it's just that they're ignorant about the game and don't know how bad ninja is vs grouped bloons.
1. I said short maps, that also applies to maps like zen garden and wizard's keep, not just pools.
Instead of saying the top 5 overrated towers, because imo there aren't really any right now, since it's mostly just ignorance. I'm just going to say the youtubers are overrated and if you want to actually improve at the game, watch mkoth/icbc videos and watch the tutorials where Toast schools Bruno and Locky on good strategies to use on maps.(Type something here...............)
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Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostJust like my other post, you seem to feel at least a little strongly about my list here. I'll try asking you, then: What is your list for top 5 most overrated towers? You seem to know a lot about the game; you should be able to give me another good list.
2. Tack shooter
3. Sniper
4. Dartling gunner
5. Banana farm
I needed a new signature and profile picture because the bloonchipper is not in the game anymore. The new tower:
It’s a corrosive glue gunning layer stripping road spiking buff giving MOAB exploding transforming bloon shrinking tower dependent fairly cheap banana farm. It's... The Alchemist!
RIP Bloonchipper. You were a good tower
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Originally posted by naturespirit View Post5. I said this with classic in mind and an actual match, not where you try to go for world records or play clubs. Also if you think ISAB and Tyler are good at the game, no wonder you think I'm good at the game.
4. Again, like I said with ninja, that's just people being stupid.
3. Good
2. It's not really people "overrating" ninja, it's just that they're ignorant about the game and don't know how bad ninja is vs grouped bloons.
1. I said short maps, that also applies to maps like zen garden and wizard's keep, not just pools.
Instead of saying the top 5 overrated towers, because imo there aren't really any right now, since it's mostly just ignorance. I'm just going to say the youtubers are overrated and if you want to actually improve at the game, watch mkoth/icbc videos and watch the tutorials where Toast schools Bruno and Locky on good strategies to use on maps.Last edited by The Mochinator; 24-11-16, 03:04 AM.My shameless advertising:
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Oops, I forgot to answer to Ptolemy's counterarguments! Might as well treat everyone equal.
Originally posted by Ptolemy2002 View PostThe late game stuff pretty much balances the entire tower there.
Not really. The fact that super monkey is completely unviable at every stage of the game except past round 30 makes for a pretty crappy tower.
Not true at all. Not one bit.
Are you sure about that? Keep in mind that the robo plasma has trouble taking down a few FC BFBs and their immediate MOAB children, and is still several times more expensive than the SMFC.
Then don't use blade sacrifices.
That's not the issue. The issue that even with the blade sacrifices, the temple is still not quite strong enough. In my opinion, anyway. Maybe it's just my soft spot for Flash stuff acting up again, though.
You just proved why this tower IS NOT overrated.
The tower is overrated for its limited niche of the first 7 rounds of the game. After that it becomes obsolete. In Assault, anyway. Defense gives engineer a good chance in the game.
Then get multiple bloon traps.
Uh, cost? Keep in mind that the bloon trap is a little more expensive than a banana plantation and doesn't return nearly as much; not to mention that earlier engineer upgrades do not generate cash while the farm does.
You do have a point there...
Yay.
They don't use it to POP the bloons, they use it to TAKE AWAY regrow/camo properties so that OTHER TOWERS can pop the bloons.
Uh, what? My reaction to this sentence was presumably the same as naturespirit's reaction to me saying the cannon is an underrated tower. Reactor does indeed pop bloons when submerged, and it only removes camo, not regrow. Build a reactor in the Battle Park pool, get rid of every other attacking tower, and see for yourself. (Eh, and 2/0 chipper for ceramics.)
Depends on what upgrades you have for the dart monkeys. Triple darts can definately defend that.
Yeah, in one game I had like 3 triple darts and a jug behind the reactor and I boosted. No dice.
First Strike: can kill 20 grouped MOABS, 10 BFBS, or 1 ZOMG anywhere on the track in 1 powerup no problem.
Spike storm: can defend 1 ZOMG with 5 powerups. Otherwise, you have to wait until the MOAB classes get to the end and it usually just flies past your spikes. Even if you kill it, you can't defend the ceramics that come after. Also, spike machine gains power OVER TIME whereas the sub has power ALL THE TIME.
Once again, I have a sneaking suspicion that my soft spot for Flash stuff is the culprit again. Still, in late game spike factory deals more collateral damage to blimps during late game as sub loses its instakill power.
Doesn't mean a bad TOWER, just means a bad PLAYER.
I'll surrender that one to you and naturespirit.
I have no idea what you are talking about.
When someone uses a ninja as their first and only tower, send reds, blues, and greens and the ninja user will die. Perhaps layer some pinks as well.
Nah, that's the Mortar by FAR.
But no one uses the mortar, so it's not overrated. Just okay/bad. Everyone uses the *vomit* wizard though.
It pushes back the bloons. with a tempest tornado, you can keep the bloons away so that it never gets past the track. Also, your other towers will be able to handle it.
Not regrows. Tornado wizards will multiply the regrows like crazy until you die. It's viable against normal/camo ceramics, and...that's it.
That's because The monkey Apprentice isn't good against regrows. Regular bloons get owned.
True, but there's still many better options--one 2/0 chipper, for example.
What you did in this post was take some of the best towers, and name them "overrated" because of really small thing that don't even reflect the point of the tower. All of these "overrated" towers are in the top 10 list for the best towers.
Super monkey ranks 3rd.
Engineer ranks 10th.
Sub ranks 6th.
Ninja ranks 5th.
Apprentice ranks 4th.
You need to actually see the goal of the existence of the tower and then judge it by that instead of judging it by the parts that they are horrible at because they were not meant for that purpose.My shameless advertising:
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Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostNot really. The fact that super monkey is completely unviable at every stage of the game except past round 30 makes for a pretty crappy tower.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostAre you sure about that? Keep in mind that the robo plasma has trouble taking down a few FC BFBs and their immediate MOAB children, and is still several times more expensive than the SMFC.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostThat's not the issue. The issue that even with the blade sacrifices, the temple is still not quite strong enough. In my opinion, anyway. Maybe it's just my soft spot for Flash stuff acting up again, though.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostThe tower is overrated for its limited niche of the first 7 rounds of the game. After that it becomes obsolete. In Assault, anyway. Defense gives engineer a good chance in the game.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostUh, cost? Keep in mind that the bloon trap is a little more expensive than a banana plantation and doesn't return nearly as much; not to mention that earlier engineer upgrades do not generate cash while the farm does.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostUh, what? My reaction to this sentence was presumably the same as naturespirit's reaction to me saying the cannon is an underrated tower. Reactor does indeed pop bloons when submerged, and it only removes camo, not regrow. Build a reactor in the Battle Park pool, get rid of every other attacking tower, and see for yourself. (Eh, and 2/0 chipper for ceramics.)
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostYeah, in one game I had like 3 triple darts and a jug behind the reactor and I boosted. No dice.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostWhen someone uses a ninja as their first and only tower, send reds, blues, and greens and the ninja user will die. Perhaps layer some pinks as well.
Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostTrue, but there's still many better options--one 2/0 chipper, for example.I needed a new signature and profile picture because the bloonchipper is not in the game anymore. The new tower:
It’s a corrosive glue gunning layer stripping road spiking buff giving MOAB exploding transforming bloon shrinking tower dependent fairly cheap banana farm. It's... The Alchemist!
RIP Bloonchipper. You were a good tower
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My opinion:
5. Helicopter
Helicopters are good in most scenarios, but they are like robo dart heads, they barely have popping power, even apache struggles with regen ceramics. A lot of people, including myself, have used the helicopter to defend regen rushes of death.
4. tack shooter
A lot of people use tack shooters to defend rushes, I have seen a lot on flash, not so much on mobile, but still. Tack shooters are bad because ring of fire got nerfed to hell, even 2 have trouble defending all out regen rainbow rushes of death. They still can't see camo. just get a bloon impact and a cluster or bloonjitsu to defend regen rainbows, or a reactor with one or two clusters.
3. Engineers
Cleasing foam is pathetic.
2. Boats
Boats are good for maps with lots of water, but boats fall short in popping power, destroyer cannot defend grouped regens, nor can cannon ship, aircraft carrier is only avaible option.
1. Wizard
Wizards are way too expensive, lightning only hits 25, while glaive ricochet can hit more than 4* as much.
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Perhaps I will go try hard defense after all.
Originally posted by Ptolemy2002 View PostNormally, I would agree with that, but the super monkey is so good, I just can't.
By the time you start getting super monkeys, you have like 5000 eco and it doesn't even matter how good that upgrade is because you can get technological terror easily after that.
Ok. I can accept that.
Not obsolete...
Bloon trap is actually a pretty non-expensive tower. If you can pull off a bunch of spike machines, you can definately do multiple bloon traps.
I know that it pops bloons, but that is not the purpose of getting the tower.
If you had 2 more triple darts you probably could have done it.
I forgot about that.
Try putting those two against each other on the Great divide map in sandbox mode in BTD5 and see which one is better.
Still, the point is not which is a better solo tower against one specific rush. Bloonchipper, before round 22, is strictly a support tower. It's not meant to solo a whole ceramic, it's meant to strip away the lead or ceramic layer so the dart monkey can pop it. Not to mention, the bloonchipper is much cheaper. At least bloonchipper will actually weaken regrow rushes in some (but not all) situations, while tornado wizards only cause them to multiply faster than a bunch of mutated rabbits and rush through your defenses faster than Usain Bolt on steroids while being chased by said mutated rabbits.Last edited by The Mochinator; 24-11-16, 06:19 AM.My shameless advertising:
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Originally posted by APOGD View PostBloonjitsu is best, no doubt about it, so why is ninja on here.My shameless advertising:
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Oh...I think I found one last piece of ammunition to deflect.
Originally posted by Ptolemy2002 View PostNo. actually, it is fire breath because it gives the wizard a lot more power over regrows, which are basically it's only weakness.My shameless advertising:
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Originally posted by The Mochinator View PostOh...I think I found one last piece of ammunition to deflect.
It's only weakness other than fast bloons, ceramics, MOABs, BFBs, and ZOMGs you mean? Fire wizards don't do any better than your 3 red-hot spikes against any decent-sized regrow rush. They completely suck against every blimp, and ZOMGs are 99.99% impossible to defeat with only wizards except in a private Megaboost Bananza match.(Type something here...............)
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