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Bloons TD Battles Update 6.6 - Patch Notes

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  • #31
    Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
    Knowing powers beforehand doesn’t solve the problem of copy eco etc being autowins against aggressive eco strats. How does that make the game more skill based? By forcing everyone to use the same strat?
    That is why I said to rework powers like copy eco. Powerups is a big mess with a bunch of overpowered and underpowered powers, there is no way developers can fix at least 50% of that mess, considering how slowly and roughly they push balance changes. The purpose of making powers visible is to encourage strategy instead of dumb guessing, since aggressive salted wounds and passive eco boosts exist together and are almost equally as good.

    f for free powerups
    Last edited by If Confused Alligator; 03-05-20, 08:22 AM.

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    • #32
      I just read through this thread and as always, its either the demand for tack to be nerfed because of 2/3 early game or tack doesnt need nerfing because tack is early game

      You guys should check out Tack/Village/Chipper, just saying.....

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      • #33
        Ninja Kiwi should balance way more often, like weekly/monthly. They should look at the most used towers/strats and balance accordingly.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          On paper it it looks like more variables would make games more interesting and less repetitive. But with powers we ended up getting the opposite effect. The way to prevent games from becoming repetitive is to ensure that there’s adequate counterplay to every strategy. Otherwise the one that doesn’t becomes the best and everyone is forced to use that same strategy.
          agreed: obvi counterplay is required for every strat or like u wrote we'all end up using the same one. however, i don't agree that powers r to blame.
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          In Bloons TD Battles, the core counterplay comes from Bloon sends that everyone has access to immediately. When track powers can wipe out rushes for free, damage boost lasting an eternity without leaving a window for the opponent to send a second rush, eco amp/choke giving more/less money without requiring thought or timing, copy eco and rubber to gold unfairly hosing bloon eco strats that need to send Bloons, and bloon/sabo powers being an autowin if your opponent doesn’t have powers and an autolose if they do results in everyone being forced to use the same lategame farming strategy.
          well not immediately but yh bloon sends r obvi an intricate part of this game. track powers wipe out early rushes & not for free but for energy. damage boost does last a while but is only as good as it's def towers already placed & depends on the rushes being sent, etc. eco choke used to annoy me lol but i disagree, after using it there is timing & thought involved, at least a little, not much less than the thought behind any other strat lol. & the counterplay for that is early use of copy eco/rubber to gold, etc. not sure what u mean by bloon/sabo powers being an autowin vs an opponent w/o powers? when do we have powers vs opponents who don't in the arena? aren't they all free now it seems like? & yes i agree that the lategame farming strat is common.. well.. for lategame lol. but i'v seen many pros on YT stomp farming strats w/eco strats so it can be done. i get u r looking for the fastest win possible to earn medallions & grind wins, etc. but eliminating lategames kinda takes away the spirit of TDGs imo.
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          Previously this was either Heli farm ice or ninja farm engie with glue storm, damage boost and eco choke or dual eco boost. That’s why there are demands to nerf powers and for a boosts only mode.
          there r already boosts only arenas!
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          in BMC, there’s no real-time opponent to face against and everyone uses all 20ish towers at the same time so bloon trap giving money is not an issue. In Battles however, because there is an opponent and there’s a 3 tower limit meaning there are tower combinations that exist besides farms and engineers, bloon trap giving money unfairly shuts down bloon eco strategies. Simply put whoever has more money will win.
          yes i get u favor eco over farm. if farms & traps were made useless & everyone was forced to go eco then u'd love that & this game would favor the vets over noobs even more. i'm sure we can agree that somekind of balance between eco/farm strats does need to be achieved, but i don't believe this would b accomplished simply by over nerfing farms & traps, it would just favor eco strats again w/o a fair balance & powers would become even more important! ik there r vets such as yourself who want to win micro vs micro, but there r many like me who would prefer more strategy b added to the game.. strategy over micro skills for TDGs makes more sense.. this is not a shooter game. powers helps those of us not drilling the mouse/keyboard or abusing shortcuts, macro autokey scripts etc. or wateva else the pros have gotten used to over the years. some of us just want a fun chill game to play.
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          A sandbox mode to test strategies has been suggested for years and the tutorial needs to be fleshed out more.
          agreed
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          Random or not, 4th towers limit strategies rather than expand them because they take away times when the opponent can counter that strategy.
          how so?
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          Cards always had fewer players than classic players. That’s why there are fewer arenas otherwise the already small playerbase would get divided further and nobody would be able to find a match. I like cards a lot but there are major issues plaguing it. Powers first and foremost, second being that most cards are useless. For example the 4/2 glue card wasn’t used until now that it can slow MOABs.
          yes ik more ppl play battles than they do cards just like more ppl play powers over classic, etc. if cards arenas need to be limited then at least one arena for ea tier of player skill.. not two of the lowest arenas & two of the highest arenas lmao. one low, one high, two in the middle makes most sense to me. i also agree that many of the cards are useless as u say but this is true for all card games that battle in such a manner. i would like to see better cards added so that everyone is not forced to use the same cards for a good deck.
          & as far as vet pros such as yourself who hate on powers & want to keep nerfing them.. i have a better solution: test this out by making a no powers arena like oldskl classic or something & c how popular it is compared to the others. ezpz. it would b nice to see a def arena added as well for a chance to earn medallions as well as a doubles match arena where 2 players team up vs 2 other players.. tho i imagine that would b much more challenging for the devs to implement.
          Originally posted by BTD Battles Scrub View Post
          Nice picture by the way.
          thanks! i am certain that my arena concept would b quite popular among both noobs & vets alike! it would also b profitable for Ninja Kiwi just as the cc arena has been. i'm sure my level of play represents a significant portion of members. u have a handful of pros, a constant flow of noobs,& then the rest of us in the middle.

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          • Salmon
            Salmon commented
            Editing a comment
            Nice to see someone still active in this community!

        • #35
          I’m on mobile so formatting all those quotes is not going to happen

          1. In arenas there is no energy so powers are free.

          2. The only 2 towers that DONT work well with damage boost are MOAB maulers and temples. Even the other bomb and super monkey upgrades prefer damage boost over other powers overall.

          3. When playing with farms eco amps are fired off immediately. When playing against farms eco chokes are fired off immediately. Not much timing involved there. With eco strats amps/chokes are used before rushing rounds to give/stop extra cash.

          4. How do you expect someone to defend a QS+TTS rush with just default powers? What are you supposed to do after wasting all your money on a QS+TTS rush only for the opponent to wipe it out for free?

          5. I can stomp lategame farming strats with eco in boosts only. That means the problem is powers not towers.

          6. My favorite strategies are aggressive eco strategies like dart ninja/glue ace and boat ice mortar. I personally don’t have a problem with other strategies someone else might like as long as I’m allowed to do something about it and not be forced to just sit there and lose. That’s why I didn’t want the farm nerfs and wanted bloon buffs instead.

          7. I have the APM of a turtle soaked in molasses. Micro is a skill but it’s not the only skill. There’s also game knowledge and planning ahead with each tower favoring a specific skill.

          8. The vets prefer farms. Specifically dart farm ace.

          9. 4th towers remove weaknesses in strategies. If dart farm ace gets a 4th tower that has cheap lead popping they get way better farms because they don’t have to buy a jug. If dart farm ice gets a 4th tower that’s good vs MOABs then they don’t have to worry about losing late because they have both aoe and moab defense. The list goes on.

          10. Over half the cards should be buffed but that’s a whole separate thread.

          11. I want an old school or boosts only cards mode. The only reason I can think of why they wouldn’t add one is because there aren’t enough cards players.

          12. This game will always have a “pyramid” distribution of players but the problem is that there aren’t enough players to warrant adding more arenas to divide the playerbase further. They even now alternate between lead dungeon and rainbow ruins and stopped doing club challenges. Instead the entry fees should change.

          My overall opinion is that there should be as many viable strategies as possible with as much counterplay to them as possible. That’s how you can have a self-regulating game that would need as few balance changes needed.

          Also powers hurt newer players the most.
          I saw a button that said edit post signature so I did.

          I forgot I have a Youtube channel:

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          • #36
            I only play Defense mode and I'm not sure about the other modes, but Copy Eco is too OP.

            It's generally a good idea to save for +70 eco on round 1, but the Copy Eco players copy your eco after you hit +70 and then hit +70 (or farm and continue to copy your eco). Not having to build eco in the early rounds is a huge advantage.

            And it completely breaks the Cobra tower. Copy Eco + Knock Out with Cobras is pretty much an instant win, even when I already know this is their strategy! -_-

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            • #37
              Originally posted by TheGreatDivide View Post
              I only play Defense mode and I'm not sure about the other modes, but Copy Eco is too OP.

              It's generally a good idea to save for +70 eco on round 1, but the Copy Eco players copy your eco after you hit +70 and then hit +70 (or farm and continue to copy your eco). Not having to build eco in the early rounds is a huge advantage.

              And it completely breaks the Cobra tower. Copy Eco + Knock Out with Cobras is pretty much an instant win, even when I already know this is their strategy! -_-
              Copy Eco can be counterplayed by playing passive with banana farms, but if the opponent can't counterplay (because of not having farms/cobras), yes, it is stupidly overpowered. It is the main thing that encourages the Rock Paper Scissors style of gameplay.

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              • #38
                Originally posted by If Confused Alligator View Post
                Copy Eco can be counterplayed by playing passive with banana farms, but if the opponent can't counterplay (because of not having farms/cobras), yes, it is stupidly overpowered. It is the main thing that encourages the Rock Paper Scissors style of gameplay.
                Ah, I play Bomb+Village+Ninja+Bonus. It's a good strategy against most cobra players, and I win more often than not against temple players (depends on the length of the track, shorter is better for me). But yes, copy eco players have the advantage when they play against me.

                Farms without eco can work (tho maybe harder now after the 6.6 update!), but you're also putting yourself at a disadvantage, and they will usually have cobras or farms anyway. It's more like a level playing field at that point. It's never at a significant disadvantage like how eco players are.

                EDIT - not my game, but here you can see just how stupidly OP copy eco is when combined with cobras: https://battles.tv/watch/LHHBYYM

                Last edited by TheGreatDivide; 21-05-20, 08:14 AM.

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                • #39
                  I would like to see the ability to set powers based on game mode. Use these powers for defense mode, these ones for card battles, and so on. I don't even know how many times I have started a defensive game with a useless bloon power.

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